I been exploring the Emergent Conversation on line and learned a lot about it. I find a lot of their ideas to be good. I question the financial avenues of Emergent as an organization and I think Brian McLaren gets a bit new agey at times, but I think their hearts are in the right place for the most part. I dont think they should be bashed by people like Ingrid at the Slice of Laodecia who impresses me as a dogmatic bible blasting fanatic who needs to chill
I also must say that I been reading up on Mars Hill and beware. Mark Driscoll is not Emergent. he is the founder of a very sexist and very conservative movement called Acts29. I am not condemning these people, but I must say that they embrace many of the values that Emergent people would loathe. I ran into a Church back in 2003 in Mount Vernon Washington called the Gathering. I got into a severe online argument with a few women who think women should submit and stay at home. Now I find out that Church was an Acts29 plant. It no longer exists. My only contact with them was online. I never went there. I think if the Emergent Church wants to make its mark, it needs to make sure not to fall into the false traditions of men regarding the role of women. Another thing about the Gathering I noticed is they were republicans.
Whatever label you bear, realize YOU ARE THE CHURCH if you are a Christ follower. You dont need to be part of Emergent, Acts29, or any orginization.
I am probably going to visit an Emergent Cohort in Salem to see what its like. That doesnt mean I am a follower of Tony Jones or Brian McLaren. I am a follower of Christ.
I think if I can find a Church that isnt really a Church, that can satisfy my wifes need to be in a Church while not making me want to puke with a big load of Churchianity.
We may end up goign to a real Church, but my heart is not in that decision.
The place I want to check out meets in a coffee house and its in Salem Oregon. http://www.emergenttvalley.blogspot.com
I will doc up my review of it. They dont meet until the 1st Thurs in Jan.
Regardless, I want to meet a group of Christians who will tolerate that I am Egalitarian (think women can do anything man can do), a free thinker, pacifist, and NOT A REPUBLICAN. Many issues I have no stance on because I am unlearning what I know and trying to see what is in the Bible.
I am a Christ Follower and a Christian, but I am not a Churchtian.
Peace and Love and God Bless You
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Thanks for dropping your comment on the blog. I look forward to meeting you and reading a few more posts on your blog.
Not sure how many people we'll have at the next meeting. We had 5 the first time and 3 the next? Not sure what will become of this.
Again, look forward to meeting you in January.
Tom
"I think if I can find a Church that isnt really a Church, that can satisfy my wifes need to be in a Church while not making me want to puke with a big load of Churchianity."
I hear your heart on this one, and I can relate. My wife and kids continue to go to the church I left. I don't have a problem with it, but it's been all to easy to grow spiritually in different directions.
I wish I had the time to have a small group in my home.
Okay, first of all, I would like to say that I am glad you are unlearning everything, and learning from the bible. That is good, and I believe everyone should do that. I go to college, and I have learned that a person shouldn't learn from another person but on their own. That doesn't mean to not learn from another. It means that if you do, do research on your own as well, making sure it's accurate.
Second of all, I am wanting to go to church to get spiritual. I am wanting to go because I want to worship the Lord. Emergent is a great idea, but do they have any music where you can worship Him? In the bible, it talks a lot about worshipping Him. Therefore, honey, you cannot satisfy my need to go to a church that really isn't a church. Besides, my college requires me to go.
Does going to church mean I have to like everything they believe in? NO. Does this mean I am going to be a mindless robot, acting republican? NO. My mind is made up, and no one can change my views. I believe in equality between men and women. I believe that people need to take better care of mother earth by not tearing down so many trees, and not being so abusive to the animals (animal experimentations). I am a Green not a republican, and I am going to stick with that.
Love ya
Your Wife
Hi: Church is a gathering of Christ seekers. Sometimes this gathering is helpful in encountering God, and sometimes not. Many of our Christian spiritual teachers have best encountered God in silence and solitude. The point is that we do not find God - it is God who finds us.
PG
Now I see why you liked my poem! I don't agree that women can do anything men can do. I beleive that each of us is uniquely designed to express a different facet of God's character. There are things men can do that women cna't and vice versa. We are just as capable, meaning we are not wilting violents in need of rescue from fair and noble princes. But if we were not different, with different roles and needs, why not just make a unisex humanity? I'm sure loads of people would find that very entertaining, but God didn't do things that way. Does that mean that sometimes women are better leaders? Absolutely. I think certain people are annointed for leadership and we have no right to tell God who he can and can't use. We're going to tell the Holy Spirit "Nope sorry, wrong parts, Lord!" I don't think He'll be having that. At the same time, it would be very hard for a woman to be a leader of a church and a family at the sme time without one place lacking something and probably both. That is just my humble opinion.
MJ
Thanks for your comment. It sounds like we dont totally disagree. I am not sure if you are advocating Acts29 style complimentarianism or just stating the obvious that men and women are different. Egalitarianism is equality and not sameness. Just as a black person is not white. I do not believe in sexism in Church or exclusion. You could say that a man in leadership takes away from family too. Everyone has to prioritize.
I do not believe women are to be subject to men as most complimentarians teach.
I do not sense sexism in your post though.
God bless you.
I disagree about men being in leadership. Most of the time, women are wired to be caregivers of children moreso than men. My husband is one of the most sensitive, involved fathers I know. But, his brain, about our kids, does not work like mine. I have a thousand and one things in my head about them. Women remember all three strange little weirdisms of their kids. womena re mostly the only people that read parenting magazines (hence the makeup adds) Mothering is just part of our genetic makeup. it isn't always the case, but typically it is. So that being said, I think a mother in leadership takes away more from her family than a father does. I just do. I have two kids and I know if I am busy even with my 2 classes this past month, i took more away than my husband who works all day.
OK but there really isnt a reason that a childless woman shouldnt be in leadership or that a man who has children should ever neglect them because its womans work. Marriage is definitely a partnership. Its not 50/50 its 100/100.
I also feel that men who are workaholics who put career totally first and neglect their families are practicing idolatry.
I dont know, maybe something is wrong with me but I tend to relate to women better than men at times. It works out since i am married to a woman
BTw to share something very personal here. My wife and I have been married almost 11 years and have been unable to have children. My wife is going to college so she can do what she feels God has called her to do and that is to become a counselor. My career, well its always been a way of paying the bills. I enjoy technology but I sure would feel more important if I was doing something that meant something to God. I would stay home with the kids if we ever have any in a heartbeat so that my wife could continue her career.
I do know what you mean about wired differently though. Men and women definitely seem to see things differently. Maybe I think women see things in a more interesting way.
I am not gay or anything. Just seem to be able to talk to women about deeper subjects a bit easier.
Maybe the fact I have ADD and have since I was a little kid helps too.
My husband is totally like that about being able to relate better to women. it seems to me that mena re not as comfortable talking aout how they feel and they often want to debate about topics more than engage about emotions. I get weary of the commentating.
My husband would probably be great with the kids at home now, but when they were babies, it really had to be me. I just could deal with the clingy neediness a lot better. I hear you though. Every family has to work their needs out for themselves and find the balance that works for them. I don't beleive we should have any hard and fast rules about who should be in leadership and who shouldn't. I went to a church with a woman pastor. She was really awesome. I just think that there is a reason why leaders tend to be male typically.
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